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| Abortion Disussion and Arguments | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mar 31 2014, 11:58 PM (11,996 Views) | |
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Mar 31 2014, 11:58 PM Post #1 |
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Hello. I would like for you to share your thoughts, opinions, arguments, and everything else you have over abortion. I am kinda just wanting to see what a lot of you think, as well as check out some of your guy's debates against each other. I hope to have a successful discussion and debates go on. I really wanna check 'em out. Please, let's discuss. |
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Apr 1 2014, 12:06 AM Post #2 |
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I guess I can start broad and go into detail if anyone disagrees or wants me to. I'm completely pro-choice, and I think it should be legal. Completely the woman's choice (and also the man's in some circumstances). I would much rather a woman get an abortion than raise a kid that she doesn't want to take care of, abuse her child, or put it in a shelter that's already overflowing with abandoned children. Abortion would keep the number of abandoned children lower and lead to more happiness for all parties involved. I can also see how having an abortion could leave some women with regret, but that is definitely not always the case and should not be treated as something that always happens. I hate it when people use the "exceptions" argument. The argument basically goes as follows: "I agree with abortion only when blah, blah, blah..." Their exceptions are typically rape, underage pregnancy, danger to the mother's life, etc. Why do I disagree with this argument? Because 1) It doesn't solve anything, and 2) No situation is ever the same, and people who stand by this argument clearly refuse to see things from other points of view. Also, adoption is not an option for everyone, so we should quit treating it like one. I am not a religious person, and I do not treat life as the greatest experience ever, so come at my opinion from a non-religious standpoint please. Whether or not a fetus should be treated the same as a fully grown person is also not a part of my argument because it's impossible to argue with someone about that. I personally don't view a fetus the same way I view a human that has been born, but I won't argue that point - it annoys me.  I'll leave it at that. Feel free to debate with me, and I'll gladly go into greater detail on any of these points. 
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| + Steve | Apr 1 2014, 12:09 AM Post #3 |
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Nothing wrong with it up to a certain point imo. When the fetus has taken an actual human shape and can move about they've had their chance and should just keep it since it's most definitely alive. Saw a disturbing video on Facebook the other day, I don't know if it was real or not but there as an aborted fetus in the amniotic sac, doctor poked it and it was reacting to it even looked like it was screaming. Quite a terrible thing to see since there's no way it would have survived so they'd have to have killed it. If someone lets it get that far along before they decide they want to abort it, they're an a***** as far as I'm concerned. Unless in a poor country where it's not common practice that's just plain irresponsible and sick. Anything before like the 3 month window I'm fine with though still why not earlier? It's unfair to expect a woman to have to have a child if she gets pregnant, you can take every precaution with sex short of cutting the guys nuts off and still end up pregnant, why force a 16 year old to bring up a child? it's easy to throw "adoption" out there but adoption isn't easy. Then again 16's and under seem to love having kids where I'm from
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| + Pelador | Apr 1 2014, 12:13 AM Post #4 |
Crazy Awesome Legend
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This is a tricky one because it depends what you consider a life. Some people don't consider it alive until it's a few months, others as soon as it's conceived. My personal opinion is that the current rules are adequate. You can't abort it after so many months which seems fair enough. I'd rather people didn't leave it so long sometimes before deciding that they didn't wan it anymore. It's a much more difficult procedure the longer you leave it and you are getting closer to the line between a living being and cluster of cells. If you are pregnant, please try to be as decisive as you can with your decision and not wait until the last minute. It's easier for everyone that way. All that being said, I would never want my partner to get one. I want a child too much. That doesn't mean I would stand in her way if she wanted to choose otherwise because it's her body after all. So long as it wasn't behind my back and we discussed it first. |
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| Deleted User | Apr 1 2014, 12:22 AM Post #5 |
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Deleted User
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I'm 100% against abortion. (In most cases, there are exceptions) If someone wants to have sexual intercourse, but doesn't want a kid, all they have to do is wear a condom. It's so simple. |
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| + Steve | Apr 1 2014, 12:27 AM Post #6 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Not really, no contraception method works 100% of the time you can be on the birth control pill, use a condom and use spermicide and still get pregnant. Extremely minimal chance in that case but it can still happen no matter how much someone doesn't want it to. |
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| + Pelador | Apr 1 2014, 12:40 AM Post #7 |
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Crazy Awesome Legend
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There can be more complicated reasons than just not wanting one. If my 13 year old sister or daughter got pregnant, one would assume that she was not grown enough to handle such responsibility. It wouldn't be fair on anyone to keep it at that age. Or if you are dirt poor. I know you can get benefits and extra help and support but would you really want to bring a child up to the sort of lifestyle where you don't know if you can even afford basics like milk and baby food? How about if the parents are drug users? Maybe they don't want to raise children knowing they will be around such things. |
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| Deleted User | Apr 1 2014, 12:58 AM Post #8 |
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Those are some very good points. If a 13 year old was pregnant, things would be different. I'd consider it okay for a 13 year old, to get an abortion. In my post I was mainly referring to full grown women (who are capable of raising children)who get pregnant and make up stupid excuses just because they simply don't feel like raising a child. If they're poor, I think they should still have the child, but put he/she up for adoption and visit her/him from time to time. If the parents are drug users, they should simply step up, stop using drugs, and have their child. They shouldn't use their addiction as an excuse for abortion. I know it's easier said then done, but still. Also, if a women gets raped, I think that she should have the choice to have an abortion. |
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Apr 1 2014, 01:02 AM Post #9 |
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I'll have a quick go.
So just because a woman is fully grown (whatever that means), she is capable of raising children? What logic are you going by here?
Like I said in my previous post, adoption is not an option for everyone. Adoption can be much harder than abortion in some cases, and it doesn't always work out. There are other implications, but I don't really feel like getting into them right now.
So you're basically telling meth addicts to man up and raise children? Yeah, let's see how that works out... lol
Yes, obviously. You're going by the "exceptions" logic, which is what I talked about in my post. Have you tried seeing things through the viewpoints of other people? Perhaps an eighteen year old girl who gets pregnant and doesn't have the money or maturity to handle raising a child? Try to see it through various viewpoints and walks of life if you can. Not everyone is the same, and not all situations are the same. Abortion isn't the most awful thing anyway. Forcing someone to raise a child who doesn't want to or can't is much worse. Let her do what she wants. |
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| + Pelador | Apr 1 2014, 01:03 AM Post #10 |
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Crazy Awesome Legend
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I don't think it should be ok for some people but not for others. You can't police who gets an abortion on a case by case basis. It's either illegal or it isn't. Sometimes people will make morally dubious or stupid and irresponsible decisions. That's human nature unfortunately. Can't really do much about that. |
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| Deleted User | Apr 1 2014, 01:26 AM Post #11 |
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Okay for starters,I'm not saying that all fully developed women are capable of raising children. I'm only talking about the ones that have nothing wrong with them mentally or phsyically. As for adoption, I really don't know much about it. If someone were to inform me about it, I might change my opinion on the matter. I always assumed it was simple. Sorry for my ignorance. And yes, that's exactly what I'm saying! I don't care what you're addicted to, if a child is involved in any shape, way or form, it's time to step up. And yes, there should be exceptions! We're talking about people's lives here. Abortion isn't a black and white subject. It's grey. |
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| EMIYA | Apr 1 2014, 01:27 AM Post #12 |
"I am the bone of my sword."
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Abortion to me will, regardless of the subject at hand, always be an issue that should be resolved on what the woman wants. You know a lot of countries get pissed off when the USA (the place I'm from) starts jutting itself into other people businesses or trying take control or acting like its the greatest thing since sliced cheese? Well imagine how many women must feel that someone is basically saying. "No, you don't have right to your body. You will give birth and if you don't want it, then put it up for adoption. But you have no rights, you are a female and your only right is give birth." FYI people the world is already overpopulated by a number exceeding 7 billion people. Less births isn't going to send the world into a spiral of apocalyptic despair and revert us to the primal ages. But its the main point I just mentioned. This is something that the pregnant woman should decide for herself. It's not my job, it's not the partner's job (though they might act as influence) it's not the government's job. The decision should be made by the woman herself who is pregnant. Because it's her body, it's her unborn child. Understand that taking care of a child especially now isn't nearly as easy as it was in the past. It leads a decrease in relationship happiness, it expresses harder issues on economical restraints especially for the people in poverty and because of this a lot of people are trying to refrain from having children until much later on in their life. But honestly that doesn't matter, none of that matters. What matters is that simply put, denying the right of abortion should be based upon a logical reasoning. I don't want to hear about your silly little morals. I want to hear one of you come with statistical information strongly proving that abortion will lead to a consecutive amount of problems based upon these strongly proven hypothetical reasons. I cannot stress this enough. If your going to expressively decline something. You better have something that can prove that this issue will cause problems on a statistical or informational scale. I don't care what your religion, or what your morals or what mommy or daddy told you when you were five years old. This goes for anything, politics, religion, homosexuality, gender issues. This to me is the biggest problem the world has. It's always good to have a set of morals. But when your morals start exceeding common sense or logic, that's when it becomes a huge problem and this has always been the case it seems. People always seem to want to follow with what their heart says and not what their mind says. To put it as simply as possible. Anti-Abortion to me is oppression against woman. It's an oppression that forces something against the will of females without a good reason. Let's put it on a male perspective. Imagine if someone told us men that we could only have sex by having a rough machine extract the fluid from you and then give it to the woman, you couldn't do anything about it or feel any of the pleasures we do from sexual activity. You can't masturbate, you can't watch any of your videos or sexually gratifying material, nothing. You'd be pissed off. You'd want to express your own body in the way you feel like it. Because in the end, its your body and its your decision to do as you please. There are some things that are demanded of us because they are either: 1.) have a very important physical/psycho social effect on us that is well needed or at least heavily desired. 2.) There's an effect on others that can be made. For example a vaccine to a very contagious virus would want to be given to a person because even if the person doesn't care and wants to die, we don't want to have the others being effected. But the government doesn't go around making laws forcing you to go to the dentist each year. That's your decision. Whether our have nice white teeth or buck yellow beaver incisors isn't going to make Mt. Vesuvius erupt. |
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Apr 1 2014, 01:32 AM Post #13 |
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Great post, Brofist.
Let me ask you this: Do you know anything about drugs or drug addiction?
Like Pelador said, it's either legal or it's not. There are no exceptions. We can't have long, drawn out court cases for every woman who wants an abortion. It is her body, and it is her right to decide. End of story. So yes, it is kind of black and white. This is an interesting and relevant argument I saw today: “Abortion seems to be the only medical procedure that people want to deny you based on how you got in that situation. Drove drunk, got in an accident and need an organ transplant? No problem. Messing around with a gun, accidentally shoot yourself in the leg and need surgery? Of course. Smoke tobacco for most of your life and need treatment for lung cancer? Yep. Climb a tree, fall out and break your leg? We’ll fix that right up. Have sex and get pregnant when you don’t want to be? YOU GOT YOURSELF INTO THIS SITUATION AND YOU DESERVE NO MEDICAL HELP OR COMPASSION! THIS IS YOUR FAULT AND YOU WILL DEAL WITH THE CONSEQUENCES!” I understand that there is a difference since abortion involves two "lives," but morality aside, it's a solid argument. Edited by Doggo Champion 2k17, Apr 1 2014, 01:37 AM.
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| Tonneh | Apr 1 2014, 01:38 AM Post #14 |
 
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I think it should be completely legal and readily available everywhere on request up until that certain time-frame which has been mentioned previously. Edit: Not saying it shouldn't be available after the time-frame; But a decision should be made before it crosses that line from fetus to baby. Bringing a child that you don't really want / can't / whatever reason raise to the best of your ability - then you probably shouldn't be having the child. This isn't saying that you need to provide the "white picket fenced dream" - But be able to spend time with, feed, clothe, educate and raise your child to try and have a future. We have no real reason to deny what should be a basic right. Edited by Tonneh, Apr 1 2014, 01:42 AM.
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| EMIYA | Apr 1 2014, 01:54 AM Post #15 |
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"I am the bone of my sword."
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Here's the difference between those so called "two lives" One involves someone who has cognitive and logical abilities and is capable of making decisions. The other is semi-conscious creature that is literally nothing more than symbiotic commensalism to the mother host. And that at its best, at its worst fetus' and heck children in general probably act more like parasites than anything else. An unborn child doesn't have the cognitive functions to understand its surroundings, its issues, its anything. A fetus can't come out and tell you. "Sirs and madams, if it would appease the court I would like to bring up several paper works that I could potentially create if I am born. I specifically turn to page 83 of Abortion: President or Murderer and point out how Sigmund Freud acted on the..." This isn't a lottery ticket. This isn't like e you get an abortion and the doctor hands you a ticket saying "If your child had been born he would have been: A DOCTOR!" |
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